Going Deep Podcast

Our 50th Show

Sep 12, 2019

This episode is Going Deep's 50th show!  Well...at least this version of the show.  John and Marcia started Going Deep when they were in West Lafayette, Indiana.  In this episode, we trace how they made their way to Asheville, and look back at the guests and issues that have really stuck with them since Going Deep started coming out of Blue Ridge Public Radio's studios.

(Music featured includes P Flunked Fun by Podington Bear)  

The 2019 NFL season starts without one of the league's star players.  Two weeks before the season was set to begin, Andrew Luck announced his retirement from the game after just seven seasons.  The 29-year-old Indianapolis Colts quarterback's decision stunned the sport and fans.  This episode sifts through the reaction - including booing from fans - to look at the physical and mental toll the sport takes on NFL players, before concluding with a beatifully thought-provoking response from Marcia to the question 'What is a fan owed?"

Dr. Joseph Cooper Part 2

Aug 2, 2019

In this episode, our hosts continue their conversation with Dr. Joseph Cooper, author of the book From Exploitation Back To Empowerment: Black Male Holistic (Under)Development Through Sport And (Mis)Education.  They focus on 'special admissions' that universities use to admit athletes - and how that really hurts and not helps the people who get them.

(Music featured includes Broken Soul Blues by Squire Tuck)  

Dr. Joseph Cooper Part 1

Jul 24, 2019

The Shoops welcome Dr. Joseph Cooper to the show in this episode, which focuses on his book From Exploitation Back To Empowerment: Black Male Holistic (Under)Development Through Sport And (Mis)Education.  Their conversation is so in-depth and engrossing that we've split it into two episodes.  In the first, Dr. Cooper talks about his upbringing and how it led him to write a book about how major revenue college sports exploit African-American males in particular.

(Music featured includes Aim by Nctrnm)   


Jul 16, 2019

On July 7th, 2019, the U.S. Women's National Soccer Team won its second consecutive World Cup title.  Their dominant run in the tournament sparked some controversy, but even that only underscored what a cultural force the team has become, not just in the U.S. but globally.  In this episode we examine how that came be, and how a very well-known law helped women's soccer in the U.S.

(Music featured includes Skip Street by Chad Crouch)  

John Beilein is the latest big name college coach to jump from the NCAA to the NBA, moving from the University of Michigan to the Cleveland Cavaliers.  The college to pros pipeline has always seen a lot of action for the NFL and NBA.  But which level is more challenging to coach at - college or the pros?  One of our hosts has done both, and he shares his answer.

(Music featured includes You Wasted My Time When I Was Timewasting by Podington Bear)  

With the month of June over, that means all four major North American sports leagues have conducted their annual player drafts.  With that fresh in our minds, John & Marcia sat down with BPR's Matt Bush to figure which of the four drafts is most fair to players, and which one they would want to enter if they had the choice.  

(Music featured includes Vienna Jazz by Dee Yan-Key)  

The 2019 NFL Draft takes place from April 25th to the 27th.  This episode doesn't focus on who's going to get picked and where.  Instead, it examines the language used to evaluate players - and John's chilling realization about one aspect of the draft combine process that resembles the darkest chapters of American history.

2019 Final Four

Apr 4, 2019

Where does all the revenue go?  Marcia asked that at the end of our previous episode, and we start our second annual Final Four show by answering that question.  Later on we get Machiavellian, and ask whether the end justified the means about the head coaches of two schools appearing in the 2019 men's Final Four.

(Music featured includes No Noise Nose by Macchiato Funky)  

The 2019 NCAA Men’s basketball tournament will undoubtedly be remembered for many things.  One of them happened early on the first full day of the tournament.  As Michigan State struggled to put away underdog Bradley, Spartans head coach Tom Izzo started yelling at freshman star Aaron Henry as he approached the bench during a timeout.  Izzo became so heated as he yelled that Spartan players had to restrain him.  The controversy it sparked may have been predictable, bouncing between those who felt it was just old-fashioned hard coaching, and others who saw it as bullying.  Our hosts at the s

The Kaepernick Settlement

Mar 21, 2019

In February 2019, Colin Kaepernick and Eric Reid reached a financial settlement with the NFL over their grievances following the 'Take A Knee' protests that garnered so much attention and controversy.  What message does the settlement send?  John and Marcia decided to bring that up with the man they first talked to about the 'Take A Knee' protests on the show, Washington Post columnist and ESPN contributor Kevin Blackistone.  

(Music featured Please Wake Up by Meydan and Princess Cheese Burger by Komiku)  

In the second part of their conversation with Maurice Clarett, John and Marcia examine what happened to the star running back after he was kicked out of Ohio State University.  Clarett was selected in the NFL Draft but cut a short time later after not making an impact on the field.  He wound up in prison in 2006, but jail was far from the final chapter in his life.  This episode finishes with Maurice offering a piece of advice to all young athletes - advice that caught our hosts off-guard in the best way possible.

When attending the premiere of the HBO documentary 'Student Athlete' last year, John & Marcia met someone who's a familiar name to even the most casual college football fan - Maurice Clarett.  While many know who he is, few know his real story.  Maurice certainly does, and he shares it with our hosts.  This episode examines his his recruitment to Ohio State University and leading the Buckeyes to the 2002 national championship in his freshman year.  Clarett was kicked out the school a year later because of NCAA violations, which he also details on the show.

Super Bowl 53

Jan 31, 2019

In our second annual Super Bowl episode, the Shoops examine how the NFL handled race and the effects of the 'Take A Knee' protests in the year after they dominated headlines - and John and Marcia found they were not encouraged by what has transpired.

(Music featured includes PC Plodder by Ketsa)

In our last episode "Losing", John & Marcia agreed that the toughest kind of loss is one where the key play or key moment of a game is decided by a missed or blown call by an official.  It only took a month for their point to be proved.  This year's NFL Conference Championship games both went to overtime for the first time in league history.  That didn't make headlines though - the officials did, mostly for a missed pass interference call in the NFC championship game.  Our hosts talk about why these types of losses hurt and an


Dec 20, 2018

What is it about losing that makes people, and sports fans in particular, act so irrationally?  The Shoops delve into that personal - and at times painful - topic in this episode in the search for an answer.

(Music featured includes Pounded Piano and Senseless by Podington Bear)  

December is an exceptionally stressful time of year for football coaches.  It isn’t just a time for preparing for bowl games or recruiting.  If you’ve had a bad season, you may be getting fired.  A good one, and you may be getting a job at a bigger school.  At the very least, you’re likely a part of coaching rumor mill that goes into overdrive.  It’s commonly called the coaching carousel, but our hosts start this episode by telling us it’s a different amusement park ride that the experience is most like.

(Music featured includes Onwards Updwards by Ketsa)  

This episode picks up where the prior one left off - with a continued look at the culmination of events starting from the death of University of Maryland football player Jordan McNair to the firing of the Terrapins head football coach on Halloween night.  In this episode, we focus on power - the power of money, the power of trauma, and the power of collegiate athletes.

(Music featured includes Trusting Each Other and Fog In The Street by Borrtex)  

On Halloween night, our hosts were ready to record an episode looking at some current events in sports with BPR's Matt Bush.  Five minutes before recording was set to start, the headline flashed - the University of Maryland had fired head football coach D.J.

This episode picks up where the last one left off - with Patton Robinette running off the campus of UNC-Chapel Hill before the first day of classes starts.  He leads on our hosts through his journey on what happened next, including a history making redshirt freshman year at Vanderbilt to his decision to end his career to focus on medical school.

(Music featured includes Kid Kodi and Copley Beat by Blue Dot Sessions)  

In an ultimate 'what could have been' story, our hosts talk with Patton Robinette.  John recruited him during his last season at the University of North Carolina, to the point that Patton had committed to going to Chapel Hill.  When John and the rest of the staff were fired over the growing academic scandal at the school, it started a long journey for Patton, who wound up at Vanderbilt University and is now done with football and in medical school.  In this episode, our hosts introduce us to Patton and talk about his recruitment to UNC - and how he never played a down there.

Sedentary Sports - Poker

Oct 11, 2018

In this episode, John and Marcia begin their examination of the rise of sedentary sports in America.  While e-sports and Fortnite have surged in popularity in recent years, they still don't come close to poker - both online and in-person.  Their guest in this episode is Darren Elias, one of the top World Poker Tour players.

(Music featured includes Brown by Nctrnm)  

Student Athlete

Oct 2, 2018

In this episode, John and Marcia discuss their appearance in the HBO documentary Student Athlete, which premiered October 2nd, 2018.  Produced by Lebron James' production company and directed by Academy-award winner Sharmeen Obaid Chinoy, the documentary examines the collegiate amateur athletic model in the U.S., and the uncompensated athletes that fuel it.  Many of the topics in the film are issues that our hosts have discussed on previous episodes of Going Deep.

Origin Stories Part 2

Sep 25, 2018

In this episode, our hosts conclude their look at the origins of the three major sports in the U.S.  This show in particular looks at basketball, and how one rule change prevented it from essentially becoming indoor football.  Dr. Randall Balmer of Dartmouth College also explains how baseball most closely mirrors the immigrant experience in the United States.

(Music featured includes Warm Morning by Ketsa)  

Origin Stories Part 1

Sep 19, 2018

Our hosts look at the origin stories of the three major professional sports in the U.S. - football, baseball, and basketball.  Their guest is Dr. Randall Balmer, author and professor at Dartmouth College.  They examine the social movements and cultural moments in U.S. history that gave birth to the three sports that capture fans imaginations.

(Music featured includes Darn That Weasel and Fern And Andy by Blue Dot Sessions)  

In this episode, our conversation picks up from our last show.  John & Marcia continue to examine the many ways sports and religion parallel one another - with a focus in this show on faith, outcomes, and those who wander away but return.  

(Music featured includes Musa, 6th Melody by Livio Amato)  

The Parallels Of Religion & Sport Part 1 -  Our hosts really follow the title of their show in this episode.  They 'go deep' with BPR's Matt Bush to examine the parallels of sports and religion.  You can hear the 'a-ha' moments throughout the show as John and Marcia find new connections between the worlds of sports and religion that they have inhabited throughout their lives.

(Music featured includes La Tapa Del Viernes and La Tapa Del Domingo by Circus Marcus)  

June 2018 Roundup

Jun 1, 2018

Our hosts take a look at some of the big topics in sports as June 2018 begins with BPR's Matt Bush - including the NFL's new national anthem policy making players stand or stay in the locker room during its performance, the recent Supreme Court ruling that will pave the way for legalized sports gambling across the U.S., and the Stanley Cup Finals which pit the long-suffering Washington Capitals against the upstart Vegas Golden Knights, an expansion team on the cusp of winning a championship in its first season.  This was orginally recorded as a Facebook Live chat on May 30th, 2018.

John and Marcia continue their conversation with sports economist Andy Schwarz about the Historical Basketball League - a proposed sports league that would be the first to pay college baksetball players as they receive their education.  In this episode, our hosts and guest focus on how the NCAA might react to the league.

(Music featured includes Free Fall by Bio Unit)  

The Historical Basketball League (HBL) is a proposed sports league that would be the first to pay college players as they receive their education.  Historically Black Colleges and Universities (HBCU's) would participate in the league, which is hoping to launch in either 2019 or 2020.  According to its website, the HBL "gives schools and athletes an option outside of the traditional NCAA model – providing a choice of whether to go "pro" while in college or to be amateur about it."  John and Marcia speak with sports economist Andy Schwarz, who is helping launch the league.